Curse

Shayne Hawke · May 30, 2010, 04:33 PM // 16:33

Thread retitled per request.

The update stands as it is, and it's not a question of whether the last update was necessary or not, but whether another update of the skill is necessary. Do Mesmers in PvE need a stronger Mind Wrack now in order to be viable? Are skills like Energy Surge, Psychic Instability, and Panic not enough?

The Josip · May 30, 2010, 04:51 PM // 16:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shayne Hawke

Do Mesmers in PvE need a stronger Mind Wrack now in order to be viable? Are skills like Energy Surge, Psychic Instability, and Panic not enough?

No, all these skills are underpowered compared to what some other professions can bring. At least when it comes to 99% of PvE.

People who don't play mesmer and do all kinds of theorycraft here in the forum lack the touch with reality. And reality is this: PvE is balanced for people with IQ of 60. What matters is how fast you go through the content. Now how smart you play. Skills such as Panic and Psychic in 99% of PvE mean NO DAMAGE. That's it.

And Energy Surge is OK *for a Mesmer*. But Energy Surge effect is what every buffed melee class does on auto-attack. Every second.

Del · May 30, 2010, 05:44 PM // 17:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Josip

No, all these skills are underpowered compared to what some other professions can bring. At least when it comes to 99% of PvE.

People who don't play mesmer and do all kinds of theorycraft here in the forum lack the touch with reality. And reality is this: PvE is balanced for people with IQ of 60. What matters is how fast you go through the content. Now how smart you play. Skills such as Panic and Psychic in 99% of PvE mean NO DAMAGE. That's it.

And Energy Surge is OK *for a Mesmer*. But Energy Surge effect is what every buffed melee class does on auto-attack. Every second.

so you want mesmer to become as brainless as other classes in pve? i don't see the logic seeing as how you could just roll another class if you find mesmers to be inferior to other classes. IIRC, mesmers weren't even designed as a dps class, and in hm pve, they can still do more damage than eles, so i don't see why y'all feel the need to complain.

Shayne Hawke · May 30, 2010, 10:49 PM // 22:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Josip

No, all these skills are underpowered compared to what some other professions can bring. At least when it comes to 99% of PvE.

People who don't play mesmer and do all kinds of theorycraft here in the forum lack the touch with reality. And reality is this: PvE is balanced for people with IQ of 60. What matters is how fast you go through the content. Now how smart you play. Skills such as Panic and Psychic in 99% of PvE mean NO DAMAGE. That's it.

And Energy Surge is OK *for a Mesmer*. But Energy Surge effect is what every buffed melee class does on auto-attack. Every second.

Auto-attacks are at range, deplete energy, and do armor ignoring damage in AoE? News to me.

If you think Mesmers need buffs because other classes are OP, the proper solution is nerfing the stuff that is OP, not bringing Mesmers to that level. The last thing that Mesmers should become anywhere is a face-rolling profession, because we have plenty of professions and builds that can do that, and would do better with a class that requires precision timing and thinking for bigger, more important effects.

Lithril Ashwalker · May 30, 2010, 11:02 PM // 23:02

in all honest opinion and fact. in HM monsters have +1 energy Regen, which is kinda hard for mind wrack to crack a whip on that enemy. un nerf it.

Cuilan · May 30, 2010, 11:21 PM // 23:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shayne Hawke

If you think Mesmers need buffs because other classes are OP, the proper solution is nerfing the stuff that is OP, not bringing Mesmers to that level.

That would be absolutely wonderful, but there are zero signs of that ever happening. Update did a lot, but there still is a bit of a gap. So basically the PvE change was unneeded.

Del · May 30, 2010, 11:53 PM // 23:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cuilan

That would be absolutely wonderful, but there are zero signs of that ever happening. Update did a lot, but there still is a bit of a gap. So basically the PvE change was unneeded.

and a revert is just as unnecessary. i still run an e surge build that works great with MW, taking out the synergy with hexes did next to nothing to the build.

ForgottenAccount · May 31, 2010, 11:11 AM // 11:11

Agreed with the OP that I'd like to see some of the skills reverted for PvE. In particular Overload, which has seen an increase in recharge time from 3 seconds to 12 seconds, a 4x increase in recharge time that pretty much completely eliminates the skill's former role.

Shayne Hawke · May 31, 2010, 12:27 PM // 12:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForgottenAccount

In particular Overload, which has seen an increase in recharge time from 3 seconds to 12 seconds, a 4x increase in recharge time that pretty much completely eliminates the skill's former role.

The skill recharges in approximately the same time if you're using it to hit foes when they're actually using skills, and aren't just mashing your keyboard every time it's on recharge.

ForgottenAccount · May 31, 2010, 06:37 PM // 18:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shayne Hawke

The skill recharges in approximately the same time if you're using it to hit foes when they're actually using skills, and aren't just mashing your keyboard every time it's on recharge.

Yes, however you don't always successfully hit. It's gone from being a spell you always have available to try to predictively punish enemies to a spell you have to treat like any other Mesmer interrupt spell [without the interrupt] on your bar.

Del · May 31, 2010, 06:43 PM // 18:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForgottenAccount

Yes, however you don't always successfully hit. It's gone from being a spell you always have available to try to predictively punish enemies to a spell you have to treat like any other Mesmer interrupt spell [without the interrupt] on your bar.

so get good and work on your reflexes, and get better at using it, rather than asking anet to reduce it to your skill level.

ForgottenAccount · May 31, 2010, 07:01 PM // 19:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Del

so get good and work on your reflexes, and get better at using it, rather than asking anet to reduce it to your skill level.

I'd prefer if ANet provided quality hosting with <100 ping, but yeah feel free to keep epeen waggling instead of responding to my point.

Del · May 31, 2010, 07:25 PM // 19:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForgottenAccount

I'd prefer if ANet provided quality hosting with <100 ping, but yeah feel free to keep epeen waggling instead of responding to my point.

your point is that you want low recharge spam so you don't have to use skills properly. and who's epeen waggling? i' saying rather than ask anet to make the game more user friendly, you should try to play better, if that's epeen waggling to you, then you're just plain daft.

ForgottenAccount · May 31, 2010, 07:50 PM // 19:50

Fact of the matter is, I'd rather have the original Overload back for both PvP and PvE over the new one which ArenaNet has given us. The old skill has been fine for 3 years and I've used it in PvP on a reasonably consistent basis (although it was never that great for PvE due to existence of better options).

The only reason this skill has seen a nerf in the first place is due to the change to Mind Wrack, which has taken the skill from a skill you can use to apply pressure to opponents without worrying too much about whether you're actually going to hit (and with 250ms lag + 250ms casting time and 150-250ms human reaction time - You aren't hitting much without predictively casting), to a skill whose usefulness is essentially defined by its synergy with Mind Wrack.

Skyy High · May 31, 2010, 10:14 PM // 22:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForgottenAccount

Yes, however you don't always successfully hit. It's gone from being a spell you always have available to try to predictively punish enemies to a spell you have to treat like any other Mesmer interrupt spell [without the interrupt] on your bar.

wth, "predictively punish"? You use it like an interrupt, and not a "spam savage shot and hope you hit prot spirit" kind of interrupt.

Shayne Hawke · Jun 01, 2010, 01:43 AM // 01:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForgottenAccount

The only reason this skill has seen a nerf in the first place is due to the change to Mind Wrack, which has taken the skill from a skill you can use to apply pressure to opponents without worrying too much about whether you're actually going to hit (and with 250ms lag + 250ms casting time and 150-250ms human reaction time - You aren't hitting much without predictively casting), to a skill whose usefulness is essentially defined by its synergy with Mind Wrack.

You act like the skill is now worse than it was a month ago. You can now trigger bonus damage off of all skills instead of just spells, and the damage hits in AoE adjacent range. The increased recharge and clause that reduces it just turns it into a skill that I feel the Mesmer should have more of - things that require you to make decisions based on opponents' actions in order to reap maximum benefit. Can't hit with Overload? The wiki has a list of skills that increase casting time on enemies that you can use.